'Civil servants still phone me up on the sly' - CSW interviews Alastair Campbell

When Alastair Campbell describes the stubborn, hubristic and arrogant culture he believes often exists within the corridors of Whitehall, many would argue he could just as easily be describing himself.

“The civil service is not independent,” the 57-year-old former Labour spin-doctor says with conviction. “It’s impartial. And that’s not the same thing. It exists to help implement government policy. Sometimes the civil service think they are above politics or the government. And they’re not.”

This might appear rich coming from Campbell. After all, technically he was once a civil servant himself, given that special advisers – or spads – are defined as state employees. But understanding the complex relationship between Campbell and the civil service requires going back to 1997, when Labour won a landslide victory, returning to power after 18 years in the wilderness.

Tony Blair’s time in office undoubtedly changed the relationship between the civil service and government. The biggest upheaval came from the sheer number of special advisers brought into Whitehall. During John Major’s government, the number of spads had stood at a modest eight; by 2000, Blair had 20.

Those who opposed the power of these Blairite spads – unelected and unaccountable to parliament – had two major concerns: the potential blurring of the line between party politics and civil service, and the enormous cost spads placed on the taxpayer. For example, by 2000, New Labour was spending four million pounds a year on special advisers.

Detractors also pointed out at the time how a culture of favouritism emerged in New Labour, where the traditional civil service became sidelined, and a new corporate style of administration was implemented, where spads were ostensibly in charge of nearly all aspects of government. Does Campbell agree with any of his critics?

“At the start there was phenomenal good will,” he recalls. “But I think there was a capacity problem. In New Labour, we spotted the ineffectiveness of some elements within the civil service. We would know when a civil servant would feel unable to engage in something. That’s why this row over special advisers is so overblown and ridiculous. You have to have special advisers who can engage on the political battlefield constantly.”

“When we first came into power, some of the civil servants didn’t want us special advisers there to begin with. But Tony was always very clear with myself and [Downing Street chief of staff] Jonathan Powell that we had to take our relationship with them very seriously, and work with them at all times. This idea that I was going round Whitehall clearing people out, it just wasn’t like that.”

But surely the part spads played changed dramatically when New Labour got the keys to Number 10? And, crucially, wasn’t their role considerably downsized when the coalition government came into power five years ago?

“I don’t think it was,” Campbell replies sharply. “Cameron has more spads than we had. Nick Clegg has god knows how many. Look, they talk the talk on this subject: lots of change, no more spin, blah blah blah. But they understand that if you are going to run a government, you have to have an element that is political.”

That said, while Campbell never made any secret that his loyalty was to Tony Blair and the government, he maintains he never once put any civil servant under pressure to be party-political.
“There has to be an understanding of the role political advisers play in the policymaking process,” he says. “Most democracies in the world think the idea of a minister having politically appointed advisers is an outrage. That’s nonsense. The best special advisers take the pressure off the civil service from ever having to think that they are under political pressure.”

Campbell can appear cold, ruthless, gossipy, aggressive and egotistical. The latter characteristic he openly admits to twice during our encounter. But he also has an enormous ability to charm, and put people – not least those interviewing him – at their ease. As a former journalist, Campbell understands the media game more than most. Ask him a serious question, though, and he’ll most likely start cracking jokes, or drift off into an informal anecdote to distract you from the issue at hand. A failure to pay attention in his company might easily result in Campbell dictating the terms of the conversation without you even noticing.

In the past, he has talked openly about his battle with alcoholism, and the nervous breakdown he went through in his late twenties, when he was a working hack at The Daily Mirror. And whatever his critics may say about him, Campbell has undoubtedly done much to raise the profile of mental health issues in public life.

He speaks about a recent event he did at Whitehall, where George Osborne announced that the Treasury was to become A Time To Change employer, seeking to challenge some of the stigma around mental illness. “It’s a step in the right direction,” says Campbell. “But ultimately it has to lead to a situation where those who are struggling with mental health issues in Whitehall have someone who they can talk to sympathetically, or are able to take time off when they are ill.

“There always needs to be openness when it comes to speaking about mental health,” he says. “And when I spoke to a lot of the civil servants at this event, certain people felt their departments got it. But others said they felt like their departments were living in the dark ages. It’s good that Nick Clegg has put a lot of this on the agenda. The culture around mental health is changing, but we certainly still have a long way to go yet.”

Campbell’s ability to connect with people on such a personal level might help to explain the electoral success New Labour enjoyed when he was at the helm of its media operation, first as press secretary, then in the self-invented position of director of communications and strategy at Downing Street. Few would doubt his impact: if Labour spent much of the 1980s prioritising ideological purity over appealing to voters, the New Labour project Campbell helped to shape was often accused of doing exactly the opposite. But he undeniably played his part in transforming the party into a ruthless election-winning machine.   

Which brings us to the subject matter of his new book, aptly titled Winners and How they Succeed. In his published diaries, Campbell painted a compelling portrait of the likes of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown as real human beings. (Who can forget such passages as Blair taking a 6am briefing in his underpants, or Campbell averting his gaze while he updated Mo Mowlam on government business as she lay in the bath?) Winners, by contrast, tackles such sober themes as teamship, strategy, resilience, innovation and data. There is an interview with Jose Mourinho, as well as an analytical chapter on the success of the Queen’s life. It’s the kind of book one might normally find in the self-help or business psychology section of Waterstones.

“A lot of my new book is about how to motivate people,” he explains. “It asks questions like: how can you build a team? The most awful thing that has happened under this current government is this constant denigration of public servants.” (Campbell rarely passes up an opportunity to indulge in a bit of Tory-bashing.)

“So Jeremy Hunt says that the health professionals aren’t good enough; Michael Gove says the teachers are brutal; Theresa May says that the police are terrible; Francis Maude says that the civil service are useless. How on earth do the Conservatives think they can motivate people in a culture where the message is constantly: ‘You’re crap’?”

And what about the coalition’s record over the last five years? Have any of its policies been successful?

He barely mentions the Lib Dems, but speaking to Campbell about the Tories is a bit like talking to a Manchester United fan about their greatest Manchester City moment of the last decade. David Cameron’s “Big Society” was a failed strategy, he says – primarily because it was never thought through as a long-term vision.

“Cameron doesn’t have a vision,” he says. “Or if he thinks he has a vision, really it’s just a bog standard right-wing conservative vision. I don’t have any respect for Cameron any more. I mean he’s prime minister, it’s an incredibly difficult job, I understand that. But he’s totally driven by the day-to-day managing of the media. And I really don’t think he has a grand vision for the country, let alone the world.

“Most of the big political issues that are happening in the world – whether it is ISIS, climate change, Ukraine, Greece, or the Middle East – Britain needs to have a voice at the table. And right now we don’t have one. Why? Because Cameron is playing this tactical game of politics all of the time.”

In the run-up to May’s election, expect to hear Campbell’s voice in all the usual places: the Today programme, Newsnight, Sky News. He’ll be most likely scrapping with presenters, or constantly reminding people how much he hates the Tories and The Daily Mail. Predictably enough, Campbell’s money is on Labour to win the next election.

But can he really be so sure? In a recent article, the British philosopher John Gray described Ed Miliband as a member of an out-of-touch metropolitan elite, unable to speak to ordinary voters in a language they understand. Does Campbell agree with Gray’s diagnosis?

He avoids the question head on, but insists Miliband has what it takes to drag Labour back into power. “Even [back in the New Labour days] when we were 20 or 30% ahead in the polls, I never went around saying: we will win. But Ed can win. And I think he will win because people don’t like the current government. Ed has shown real resilience and calm. The media have thrown a lot at him and he just keeps going.”

“People are fed up with politics,” says Campbell. “They’re not sure what it’s about anymore.”

And Ed Miliband can change this? “Ok, fair enough, Ed’s ratings aren’t great,” Campbell admits. “But you are dealing with a British press that is 85% trying to kill him, day in, day out. So that is bound to affect how people see him.

“We’ve seen recently that Cameron wants to avoid a head-to-head television debate with Ed. The reason he’s ducking out is because if Ed is at his best, Cameron knows he will lose. It’s when Ed is defined by Cameron negatively through the press that Cameron feels safe.”

Our time is almost up. As CSW prepares to leave, Campbell – perhaps concerned he has overstepped the mark at times – seems anxious to stress the positive aspects of Whitehall, claiming “there is a lot of good in the civil service on many levels”.

But perhaps his most striking comment came earlier in the conversation, when he declared: “Overall our relationship in Labour with the civil service was very good. In fact, today, some of them still phone me up – totally on the sly, Cameron would be horrified – saying, Alastair, what do you think about this issue?”

Or maybe it’s not that striking. After all, it’s hard to imagine Alastair Campbell letting a small thing like no longer being in government get in the way of dispensing his own, unique brand of special advice.

Winners and How They Succeed by Alastair Campbell is published by Hutchinson​